Messages

[DoTs]

A question that I've been asking myself (now that I have more than one Level 50 participating in Incarnate Trials) is ... which Interface options are the "most friendly" with what other teammates and leaguemates have slotted?

One of the simplest bit of quick shorthand for stacking of Interface effects:

• DoTs can stack to 8 from all sources.
• All Other Effects can stack to 4 from all sources.

What this means in practice, is that ideally speaking ... you want a fair spread of the Interface slotting options in an Incarnate Trial league, so you don't have people "stepping on each other's toes" overwriting their Interface effects on $Targets.

So, for example ...
Let's say that everyone in a league has attack powers that have 2s animation times (to keep the math simple for this example thought) and attack chains using those powers that produce a "just in time" recharge behavior. How many people can attack the same $Target with the same Interface slotting WITHOUT overwriting each other's Interface effects (against Minions, Lieutenants, Bosses, Elite Bosses)?
Let's have a look, shall we?
Interface options that deal DoTs have their names bolded.

• Cognitive: 5-6 for Confuse (Core), 10-12 for Confuse (Radial) / 8+ for Psionic DoT (Core), 2-4 for Psionic DoT (Radial)
• Degenerative: 1-2 for Max HP Debuff (Core), 4-5 for Max HP Debuff (Radial) / 8+ for Toxic DoT (Core), 2-4 for Toxic DoT (Radial)
• Diamagnetic: 1 for ToHit Debuff (Core), 2 for ToHit Debuff (Radial) / 2 for Regeneration Debuff (Core), 1 for Regeneration Debuff (Radial)
• Gravitic: 1 for Debuffs (Core), 1 for Debuffs (Radial)
• Paralytic: 1-2 for Defense Debuff (Core), 4-5 for Defense Debuff (Radial) / 4-5 for Damage Debuff (Core), 1-2 for Damage Debuff (Radial)
• Preemptive: 1-2 for END Recovery Debuff (Core), 4-5 for END Recovery Debuff (Radial) / 8+ for Energy DoT (Core), 2-4 for Energy DoT (Radial)
• Reactive: 1-2 for Resistance Debuff (Core), 4-5 for Resistance Debuff (Radial) / 8+ for Fire DoT (Core), 2-4 for Fire DoT (Radial)
• Spectral: 4-5 for Immobilize (Core), 4-5 for Immobilize (Radial) / 8+ for Negative Energy DoT (Core), 2-4 for Negative Energy DoT (Radial)

The reason why DoT (Core) options are given an 8+ count before multiple attackers reach the stack limit is because the DoTs "cancel on miss" ... and with a 25% (base) chance to proc, are highly unlikely to run for their full 4s duration of DoT ticks. Therefore, the DoTs inflicted by attackers are unlikely to stack to 8 (and stay there) for any significant length of time.

By contrast, DoT (Radial) options are not only more likely to proc, with a 75% (base) chance to proc, but they're also much more liable to run their full set of DoT ticks ... particularly with Genesis: Socket T4 slotted, increasing Interface proc chances by +10%.

With Genesis: Socket T4 slotted, you start looking at no more than 2-3 people with the same DoT (Radial) slotted before they start "stepping on each other's toes" and filling the DoT stack to the limit of 8 and then (in effect) "wasting damage output" relative to alternative choices.



Then there's the "Slot & Forget" factor, of wanting to have an Interface option that you don't need to keep changing for specific Incarnate Trials.

Cognitive: Confuse is basically "always useful" in all circumstances (in my estimation), except against PToD Resistant on Archvillains/Heroes and Giant Monsters. It keeps mobs clumped together (if they attack each other) and it redirects damage AWAY FROM the league (yourself and others). Even if you've got a lone Minion, land a Confuse on them and it's "as good as a hold" for getting them to "sit still" for you while you burn down their remaining HP.

Degenerative: Max HP Debuffs are "nice to have" but will tend to only make a difference on Elite Bosses and above ranks.

Diamagnetic: ToHit Debuffs amount to "defense via offense" (or words to that effect) and are extremely synergistic with defense protection oriented build strategies (think Force Fields, Time Manipulation, Super Reflexes, etc.). Regeneration Debuffs also fall into the "nice to have" category, and against Elite Bosses and above ranks can actually yield more "reduction in damage needing to be dealt" against Big Bags o' HP than a DoT would have been able to produce, so net win for Regeneration Debuffing vs DoTs against AV/GM ranked Foes.

Gravitic: The Debuffs (lots of them!) produced by Gravitic procs are all "nice to have" but aren't always going to be "helpful" to a league. Movement Speed Debuffing (Core) sounds great ... until you need to herd clumps of mobs into ambush points (UG and TPN Trials, in particular). Special Debuffing (Radial) sounds "weird" until you realize that it's kind of like an anti-Power Boost type effect (if you're familiar with Power Boost). Best when paired with Recharge Debuffing (Time Manipulation, Ice, et al.) and/or Endurance Drain (Electric et al.) build plans and playstyles.

Paralytic: Since this option includes no DoTs, I don't think anyone touches or bothers with this one. However, for builds with PBAoE Damage Auras/Patches (Icicles, Obliterating Death, et al.) being able to rapidly stack and maintain a 4x -5% Damage Debuff on Foes using the T4 Radial could have a lot of utility for Aggro Magnet builds (Tankers, et al.). Additionally the Defense Debuff AND Damage Debuff are likely to have pretty decent Threat Multiplier factors as debuffs, making it easier for Aggro Magnets to grab and hold onto aggro more easily than just "doing more damage" (per se) with a DoT. For AoE heavy builds, especially those that can chain multiple AoEs into a crowds of clumped up Foes, the Damage Debuff factor can make a lot of difference to the amount of incoming damage that a league is taking, especially if your powers also include Damage Debuffing natively in them (Kinetic Melee, Dual Pistols: Chemical Ammo, et al.). Additionally, Damage Debuffing synergizes directly with Resistance protection schemes, effectively yielding increased (net) Resistance beyond what hardcaps would suggest as nominally possible. Needing less animation time for healing means more animation time is available for attacking(!), which in turn could yield more damage "output" from individuals than they might have produced via DoT options.

Preemptive: The primary point and purpose of the END Recovery Debuff is to synergize with "Sapper" builds that drain endurance (often Electric).

Reactive: Resistance Debuffing sounds wonderful ... until you realize that it only stacks up to 4x -2.5% = -10% ... which isn't a lot. That's comparable to 1 leaguemate nearby having Leadership: Assault buffing everyone. While "nice to have" it isn't going to be much of a tide turner. If you think in terms of -2.5% Resistance in terms of damage equivalencies (or better yet, Interface DoT ticks):

• 10.709/0.025*1 = 428.360 ... 13.3863/0.025*1 = 535.452
• 10.709/0.025*2 = 856.720 ... 13.3863/0.025*2 = 1070.904
• 10.709/0.025*3 = 1285.08 ... 13.3863/0.025*3 = 1606.356
• 10.709/0.025*4 = 1713.44 ... 13.3863/0.025*4 = 2141.808
• 10.709/0.025*5 = 2141.80 ... 13.3863/0.025*5 = 2677.260

In a league context, with LOTS & LOTS of damage pouring into a single target, a league will be able to exceed those threshold equivalencies ... but against a single target, you'll often need 3+ people concentrating their attacks into a single target in order to exceed those threshold equivalencies. Which is a long way of saying that while Resistance Debuffing may be "icing on the cake" it is by no means "the cake itself" (so to speak).

Spectral: Definitely the odd one out in this list, but it's also the only option that offers a Mez relevant to setting up Containment for Controllers. The problem is that Immobilization isn't always a desirable effect (herding mobs in UG, TPN) (pulling Nightmares out of Pink Puddles during MoM), but can be a desirable "feature" for ranged attackers who want to avoid melee.



Something that I haven't been able to test yet is if the Special Debuff effect will "magnify" the durations of Mez effects cast onto affected $Targets (by PCs and their Pets), essentially making them "vulnerable" to those Mez effects ... which can then interact(?) with the Confuse and Immobilize durations of Cognitive and Spectral Interface procs(?) to make them last longer, because Interface procs are "granted powers" that $Targets (involuntarily) cast upon themselves?

I think I can do some controlled testing on mobs in Night Ward to see if Gravitic (Radial) Special Debuff boosts Mez durations on $Targets. If it does, I can envision circumstances in which Controllers (and Dominators) will want to make use of Gravitic (Radial) to increase their lockdown capabilities.



However, the really big takeaway I want to glean from the above analysis is ... just how "team friendly" the Cognitive Interface option really is.

It's kind of like the age old question of Leadership: Maneuvers vs Fighting: Weave comparisons when it comes to softcapping Defenses.
When soloing, Weave is "better" on yield.
However, as soon as two people on a team have Maneuvers ... everyone on the team "gets Weave level" defense ... and if you're 1 of the 2 needed, it's a lot easier to find that +1 you need to meet (and beat!) the +Defense yield obtainable from Weave.

1x PC with Cognitive (Core) isn't going to be making that much of a difference, since usually only the Minions/Lieutenants will "notice" the Confuse effect (due to limited stacking potential). It'll happen "occasionally" but not often in clutch circumstances.

2x PCs with Cognitive (Core) attacking the same $Targets ... now the Confuse can start STACKING to useful degrees of Mag and start affecting Bosses!

3x PCs with Cognitive (Core) attacking the same $Targets ... the potential to Confuse Elite Bosses starts happening intermittently.

4+ PCs with Cognitive (Core) attacking the same $Targets ... things start getting "unfair" in a hurry, for your $Targets.

What makes this observation especially interesting is that Masterminds have Pets that will "inherit" the Mastermind's Interface slot when summoned (which includes zoning). So 1 Mastermind with 6 Pets can effectively "group attack" a single target as if they were Team-7 (if the Mastermind has personal attacks that deal damage) and were all slotted with the exact same Interface slot option. So a Mastermind who slots Cognitive, Diamagnetic, Gravitic, Paralytic or Spectral can deliver a "max stack" of Interface effects MUCH faster than a soloist of another archetype can.

I've had T4 Diamagnetic Core slotted on my Ninja/Time Mastermind build for a while, and it makes my ninjas SO MUCH MORE SURVIVABLE, because each ninja pet can inflict -5% ToHit Debuffs (max stack: 4) independently, vastly improving their survival rate in sustained combat, even if they scatter to attack their own $Targets.

Something I really ought to test is T4 Cognitive Core on a Mastermind, with the notion of using an "alpha strike barrage" of Mastermind+Pets to deliver 7 chances to proc Confuse in the opening salvo against a single $Target. With Genesis: T4 Socket boosting proc chances by +10% ... that means a 30% chance per hit of a Confuse proc of Mag 2 for 4.3s. With 7 ranged attacks incoming simultaneously, that ought to average to ~2 successful Confuse procs, enough to Confuse a Boss with the opening salvo.

Of course, in solo play, my preferred option is to attack from range with my Mastermind (to draw aggro) and then use Bodyguard Mode to help "soak" any incoming fire and prompt my Pets to retaliate (almost as one in response). Keeps things simpler in terms of "directing traffic" and has better outcomes when something unexpected happens (such as drawing too much aggro!).

[Frankenslotting Knockback Powers]

Well ... that's interesting ...

So I had a little insight into Frankenslotting Knockback Powers for my Mercs/Nature Mastermind that I've been leveling. The power in question there was Slug (single target, 8s recharge, 1.67 animation) ... which yielded a proc chance of 32.23% per activation of the Slug power for a +100% Recharge for 5s proc from Force Feedback.

After implementing it on my Mastermind to verify the "yield" in-game (enhancement values, set bonuses, etc.), I thought ... what if I did the same thing to Executioner's Shot (single target, 10s recharge, 1.67 animation) in my Dual Pistols Defender builds?

Look what happens:

Level 28: Executioner's Shot

• (A) Kinetic Crash - Knockback/Accuracy: Level 27+5
  
• (29) Kinetic Crash - Knockback/Damage/Accuracy: Level 27+5
  
• (29) Kinetic Crash - Knockback/Damage/Endurance: Level 27+5
  
• (31) Kinetic Crash - Knockback/Damage: Level 27+5
  
• (31) Force Feedback - Knockback/Damage/Endurance: Level 27+5
  
• (31) Force Feedback - Chance of +Recharge (2.0 PPM): Level 21
  
  • 2.0 * ((10 / ( 1 + 0 / 100 )) + 1.67) / (60 * (0.25 + 0.75 * (1 + 0 * (11 * 0 + 540) / 40,000))) = 38.9%
    
• Hybrid Assault Radial Embodiment (6.0 PPM)
  
  • 6.0 * ((10 / ( 1 + 0 / 100 )) + 1.67) / (60 * (0.25 + 0.75 * (1 + 0 * (11 * 0 + 540) / 40,000))) = 90% (Pre-clamp: 116.7%)
    

Kinetic Crash set bonuses
2: +4.5% Movement Speed
3: +2.25% S/L Resistance, +3.75% Mez Resistance
4: -3 Knockback Protection

Force Feedback set bonuses
2: +7.5% Movement Speed

In-game reported enhancement values:

• Accuracy: 47.4%
• Damage: 117.1% (with T4 Intuition Radial Alpha slotted)
• Endurance: 42.1%
• Knockback: 172.3%
• Recharge: 0%

And, as an extra side bonus, because I could get knockback protection from a Kinetic Crash set bonus, that meant that I could swap out the slot in Hover from a Blessing of the Zephyr ...

Level 18: Hover

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed: Level 25+5
  

So effectively, on net, I "didn't" lose the +7.5% Recharge 6-slot set bonus from Kinetic Crash. I only "exchanged" the +6% Regeneration 5-slot bonus in Kinetic Crash for a +7.5% Movement Speed 2-slot bonus in Force Feedback and a reduction in knockback protection (from -7 to -3), which shouldn't be that much of a loss in a build that has Hover.



With the previous/original slotting of Executioner's Shot (with Superior Winter's Bite, shown above), the 10s base recharge was being reduced down to 2.59174787s after factoring in Hasten, Chrono Shift and global set bonuses. That's shorter than the arcanatime of Pistols + Dual Wield, making for a very TIGHT single target attack rotation (if necessary).

However, with no recharge enhancement in the enhancement slots, Executioner's Shot (with 4-Kinetic Crash and 2-Force Feedback), 10s base recharge gets reduced down to (only) 3.44827586s after factoring in Hasten, Chrono Shift and global set bonuses. In other words, the recharge enhancement of Superior Winter's Bite was only yielding a 0.85652799s reduction in recharge time on Executioner's Shot in the overall context of my build plan (so nice to have, but not exactly necessary, all things considered). The arcanatime of Pistols + Dual Wield is 3.036s ... but Pistols (in this build) recharges fast enough to "wrap around" Dual Wield if necessary, so you can do a Pistols + Dual Wield + Pistols in 4.224s to give Executioner's Shot sufficient time to recharge.

So instead of doing a 321 321 321 rotation pattern (with Superior Winter's Bite), instead you'd be doing a 3121 3121 3121 rotation pattern (with 4-KC/2-FF) in Executioner's Shot against a single target that you don't want to let any "stray" AoE spill over from (such as against the Weapons Crates and Containment Vessels during the Gathering Phase of Lambda, since those objects "do not communicate aggro" to mobs around them when hit, but AoE attacks will "splash aggro" onto mobs and draw fire onto you).



Suppressive Fire has an animation time of 1.5s and an arcanatime of 1.716s.
5.25 - 1.5) = 3.75s of arcanatime remaining in which to activate subsequent powers able to take advantage of the Decimation Build Up proc (35.83% chance!), plus 2x Psionic Damage procs (90% chance, clamped), plus 2x Hold procs (89.58% and 90% chance clamped) ... so Suppressive Fire is a "pretty decent attack" to use as often as possible so as to "fish" for Decimation Build Up procs.

• Pistols arcanatime: 1.188s
• Dual Wield arcanatime: 1.848s
• Empty Clips arcanatime: 1.848s
• Bullet Rain arcanatime: 1.848s
• Executioner's Shot arcanatime: 1.848s
• Piercing Rounds arcanatime: 2.64s
• Hail of Bullets arcanatime: 2.64s

Theoretically speaking ... you can animate 2x 1.848s attacks (take your pick) ... and consume only 1.848*2=3.696s of the 3.75s of Decimation Build Up duration available (after animating Suppressive Fire). Therefore, you can (theoretically) already have a longer duration 2.64s attack queued up at the end of the duration remaining in the Decimation Build Up and have the buff "apply" to the attack, even though the damage for it "lands" well after the buff duration has expired.

So you can pull off combo moves like this (Decimation Build Up proc duration effects apply to bolded powers):
Suppressive Fire -> Dual Wield/Empty Clips -> Executioner's Shot/Bullet Rain -> Piercing Rounds/Hail of Bullets = 8.052s total arcanatime, 6.336s Build Up buffed arcanatime

The downside to that pattern is that if your $Target "doesn't survive" while you're attacking and you need to switch targets mid-stream, you're probably going to lose the "overhang" at the end and not be able to have the Decimation Build Up buff apply to either Piercing Rounds or Hail of Bullets.

However, the "beauty" of the Piercing Rounds rotation shown above is that the 8s duration of the (standard ammo) Piercing Rounds Resistance Debuff will still be active on the $Target by the time you're able to hit the $Target a second time with Piercing Rounds, meaning you'll get a "bigger bite" out of the second rotation than you will from the first (all else being equal) due to the Resistance Debuffing. And of course, Resistance Debuffs "stack" on themselves (because of how the math works out), so things can get pretty heinous if you're allowed to sustain your Gun Fu attack rotation uninterrupted.

Also, do I really need to point out how NICE it is to be able to pull off:

• Suppressive Fire (procs Decimation Build Up)
• Empty Clips
• Bullet Rain
• Hail of Bullets/Piercing Rounds

Being able to have +40% ToHit Buff and +80% Damage on 3x AoE attacks in a row can REALLY "amp up the damage throughput" onto Foes ... and Suppressive Fire recharges in 6.9s in this build, so ... lots of opportunities for "proc fishing" ...

And even better yet is that if you're "shooting into traffic" with Empty Clips, the odds are rather high that you'll get a Force Feedback proc almost immediately. So with Hasten, Chrono Shift, global set bonuses AND the Force Feedback proc ... your Empty Clips will basically be recharged when Bullet Rain finishes animating.

Suppressive Fire -> Empty Clips -> Bullet Rain -> Empty Clips

This becomes a REAL possibility (almost a reliable one!) to exploit if you're ready to take advantage of it.

[Blessing of the Zephyr]

So I've been (casually) leveling a Mercs/Nature Mastermind and because of my build plan, I needed to obtain knockback protection from somewhere other than slotting a Blessing of the Zephyr proc in a movement power.

For specifics, the power I needed to slot for knockback protection is Slug, one of the three personal attacks. The single target attack has an 8s recharge and a 1.67s animation time.

Since Slug can be slotted with Knockback Sets, the obvious solution was to reach for the Kinetic Crash set to achieve the desired knockback protection (-3 mag for 4-slot). However, that then begs the question of whether going to a full 6-slot to reach the 7.5% recharge reduction set bonus is ... optimal.

In this case, the "middle 2" enhancements of the Kinetic Crash set (Knockback/Recharge, Knockback/Endurance) are technically the "least useful" or otherwise "most easily replaceable" parts of the set. Furthermore, dropping from 6-slot to 4-slot set bonuses drops the 5: +6% Regeneration and 6: +7.5% Recharge global set bonuses ... so what could be "a better investment" for those 2 slots?

Answer ... 2 slots of Force Feedback (Knockback/Damage/Endurance, Proc), which then has an incidental yield of a +7.5% Movement Speed instead (Nice to Have™, but not terribly relevant to the point I'm wanting to make).



Now, in terms of equivalencies, a single Force Feedback proc is "worth" +100% Recharge for 5 seconds. For simplicity of illustration purposes, let's call this "500 points of recharge bonus" to make the comparison easier. By contrast, the 6-slot set bonus of Kinetic Crash is +7.5% Recharge "at all times" that the set bonus is active.

So for the purposes of comparison, how often would Force Feedback need to proc in order to be "equivalent" (in terms of yield) to the recharge bonus of 6-slot Kinetic Crash?

500 / 7.5 = 66.66666667

In other words, 1 proc of Force Feedback every 66-67 seconds will "yield" a (roughly) equivalent amount of return in global recharge as the 6-slot set bonus of Kinetic Crash. That's basically a proc rate of 1 per 1.1 minutes to reach (mathematical, in a vacuum) parity.



So if I were to put a Frankenslot Combo of 4-Kinetic Crash plus 2-Force Feedback into a single target attack power such as Slug on a Mercs/Nature Mastermind ... what kind of yield would result from that choice?

The numbers below assume use of Level 27+5 (boosted) enhancements and the use of a T4 Radial Alpha slot that adds +11 (ED) and +22 (non-ED) damage bonus.

Kinetic Crash (2: 4.5% Movement Speed, 2.25% S/L Resistance/3.75% Mez Resistance, -3 Knockback Protection)
Knock/Dam (27+5)
Knock/Acc (27+5)
Knock/Dam/End (27+5)
Knock/Dam/Acc (27+5)

Force Feedback (7.5% Movement Speed)
Knock/Dam/End (27+5)
Proc (21)

Accuracy: 21.063+16.85=37.913*1.25 = 47.39125%
Damage:  21.063+(16.85*3)=71.613*1.25=89.51625+11=100.51625 ... 95.0774375+22 = 117.0774375% with T4 Incarnate Alpha, post-ED {87.564625% pre-T4 Incarnate Alpha, post-ED}
Endurance: (16.85*2)=33.7*1.25 = 42.125%
Knock: (37.938*2)+(30.35*3)=166.926*1.25=208.6575 ... 172.298625% post-ED
Recharge: 0

Force Feedback (2.0 PPM)
2.0 * ((8 / ( 1 + 0 / 100 )) + 1.67) / (60 * (0.25 + 0.75 * (1 + 0 * (11 * 0 + 540) / 40,000))) = 32.23%



What that means is that an attack power (Slug) with a base recharge of 8s and a 1.67s animation time, with ZERO recharge in the enhancement slots would have ... a 32.23% chance per use to proc Force Feedback.

Even with ZERO global recharge (Hasten, set bonuses, Force Feedback procs, etc.), this attack power can be used 6 times within 66.667s ... with each use having a 32.23% chance to proc Force Feedback ... in order to (mathematically) "match" the +7.5% Recharge 6-slot bonus of Kinetic Crash.

8+1.67 = 9.67*6 = 58.02s < 66.667
8+1.67 = 9.67*7 = 67.69s > 66.667

In other words, in sustained combat, odds are "decent" that the Force Feedback procs option (4-KC, 2-FF) will yield "more return on investment" than the alternative of going a full 6-slots in Kinetic Crash ... while still retaining the desired knockback protection set bonus offered by Kinetic Crash.

Net result ... if you don't mind enhancing knockback effects on knockback (capable) attack powers, then Frankenslotting a combination of 4-Kinetic Crash plus 2-Force Feedback (including proc) might be a compelling alternative to other potential options ... particularly in builds that have few (or even just 1!) knockback attack powers.

this does not display PvP information, and currently would only cover "Info tab" information, where "Effects tab" information will have to be an additional {"Effects":[{}]} entry. I'm debating how to store PvP information. perhaps each attribute with have 2 sub dictionaries {"pve": value} and {"pvp": value} or perhaps I'll do 2 different entire dictionaries Under ['PowerName'] like ['PowerName']['PvE'] and ['PowerName']['PvP']...

The tricksy thing is that not every power has separation of effects for PvE vs PvP, they just do exactly the same thing in both contexts (so why separate/duplicate?).

And then you've got PvP Enhancement Sets that have different global set bonuses depending on what context you're in (the enhancement values remain unchanged).

Simplest solution (that I can think of, anyway) is that everything defaults to PvE context, but there will be a toggle option to switch to a PvP context (kind of like toggling between Hero and Villain in Mids'?) and then *IF* there are PvP data entries for things, they'll "overwrite" the PvE data with PvP data for computation through everything downstream of the lookups.

Don't forget that there are also Challenge sets whose secondary set effects only activate while on a Task Force challenge (or whatever the condition may be)!

And that's another level of complication. Fortunately, to my knowledge, NONE of those Challenge sets have a PvE vs PvP context differential to them ... but designing the code structure around that fact could be a case of premature optimization.

Probably best to have an additional toggle option for Challenge: Y/N? and you'd be able to set it up such that (right now) the Challenge toggle would automatically toggle the PvE/PvP setting back to PvE. Doing things that way then makes it easier (later) if a PvP Challenge Set gets introduced and you need to enable that particular combination of setting at a later date.

So long as what you're doing is "modular enough" that you can rearrange where "blocks" of code interact with the UI (so you can "easily" rearrange the UI layout of stuffs when/if you need to) then you should be fine. Even if what you're doing now isn't ideal for a finished release, so long as it's "good enough" to work with and build upon right now to make sure it all works, that's good enough.

Functionality First ... Polish Later.
Once you get everything working, you can then start figuring out how to make it "pretty" in the UI at a later point.

Eye candy gets you noticed ... but it's SOLID gameplay that keeps people coming back, even for low rez graphics. 

[Alpha Intuition Radial Paragon]

7.5% Range (Rolling Barrage: 2)
7.5% Range (Rolling Barrage: 2)
7.5% Range (Rolling Barrage: 2)
10% Range (Superior Defender's Bastion: 3)
= 32.5%

Finally got enough catalysts to go Superior on Defender's Bastion and verify the theorycrafting that went into this build.

I have 2x Rolling Barrage + 2x HO: Centriole Exposure++ (Damage/Range) in Empty Clips, Bullet Rain and Piercing Rounds ... and yes, that means I needed a minimum of 18x Centriole Exposure (farmed and stockpiled from the Seed of Hamidon hunts in First Ward) in order to combine 6 of them into 50++ to achieve this result.

In game, looking at the Enhancements window, the range for Bullet Rain and Piercing Rounds reports as:
Range (base): 80 ft
Range (enhanced with Alpha Intuition Radial Paragon): +62.8% (80*1.628 = 130.24 ft)

Range (global set buffs): +32.5% (80*0.325 = +26 ft)

130.24 + 26 = 156.24 ft range ... on Bullet Rain and Piercing Rounds



For reference, most Sniper powers for a variety of archetypes are 150 ft (base) range Single Target attacks.

With the build posted above, I've got TWO "sniper range" AoE attacks (1 TAoE, 1 Cone!) that can hit up to 16 Max Targets within a 15 ft radius of my $Target (Bullet Rain) ... and up to 3 Max Targets within a 5º Cone, which at ~150 ft range is ~12 ft wide at the far end (Piercing Rounds).

Which means ... my Defender can participate in Underground Trial Bomb Runs as a "sniper" ... even though I'm (only) using PISTOLS ...

Yeah ...

[LINK]

Why not make a Fortunata?

Think I've got another answer for you, but it relies on this:

City of Data v1.0 Arachnos Widow: LINK

Widow Training (primary) = 8 power picks
Fortunata Training (primary) = 10 power picks
Teamwork (secondary) = 7 power picks
Fortunata Teamwork (secondary) = 5 power picks
8+10+7+5 = 30 power picks to take "all the Fortunata powers" but none of the Blood Widow attack powers.

Widow Training (primary) = 8 power picks
Night Widow Training (primary) = 6 power picks
Teamwork (secondary) = 7 power picks
Widow Teamwork (secondary) = 6 power picks
8+6+7+3 = 24 power picks to take "all the Night Widow powers" including all of the Blood Widow attack powers. However, there are redundancies involved, such as Follow Up vs Build Up, which are mutually exclusive. Some combinations are counterproductive, such as taking Confront and Placate in the same build.

Moreover, Night Widow feels unfinished; they get far fewer powers unlocked than Fortunata

This is where the "pick & choose" part of the exercise starts getting a bit Too Important™ for comfort.

Even if you wanted to, there's no way to shoehorn in 25+ power picks into 24 available choices between Levels 1-50. With a Fortunata, you HAVE TO leave some of the options out of your build ... you simply don't have room to TAKE THEM ALL.

By contrast, the more limited list of choices for a Night Widow demonstrates that you CAN HAVE IT ALL as far as taking ALL the AT powers (if you wanted to) ... but you don't necessarily "have to" take them all if you don't want to. That shorter list of powers makes it "easier" to dip into Pools for supplemental powers that can do all kinds of things to round out and complete your build plan. Gets even easier if you start dropping powers out of the mix (because they don't support your build goals).

So ... for example ...

If I wanted to make a Dart Widow build ... I'd really only want 5 powers from my options in primaries:

• Poison Dart
• Dart Burst
• Mental Blast
• Build Up
• Psychic Scream

If I then took ALL 7 powers from Teamwork ... AND ... ALL 6 powers from Widow Teamwork (to illustrate the point I'm making) ... that would still be only 18 power picks total (5+7+6=18). That would still leave another 6 power picks from pools (4 of which could come from the Leadership Pool) (plus Hasten) (plus Hover) and that would be 24 total power picks.

Try to do the same (kind of) thing on a Fortunata and you're looking at 10+7+5=22 power picks from your primary and secondary, leaving only 2 power picks from pools (or Widow Training) ... and you've got "nowhere else to go" for getting your powers. The net result is kind of a "Controller + PBAoE Auras" going on (with a few tweaks because you're a Fortunata).



My point being that if you want to go ALL IN on your primary+secondary powersets, you can't "have it all" with a Fortunata build ... you simply HAVE TO forgo picking some Fortunata accessible powers (because, there's too many of them to choose from!).

By contrast, with a Night Widow, is IS possible to "have them all" (minus the mutually exclusive Follow Up vs Build Up) and STILL have options for 1+ Pool powers to add into the mix. So in that sense, it's possible/easier to build a "complete" Widow with "all the things" ... without needing to compromise on power picks the way you HAVE TO with a Fortunata.

[Time Manipulation/Dual Pistols]

Why not make a Claw Stalker?

A Claws/Super Reflexes Stalker would be broadly similar to a Night Widow in terms of power picks, but the Night Widow would have a superior "team buff" potential compared to the Stalker option.

That's the REAL "secret sauce" of the VEATs ... they "stack" better in teams (and leagues) due to their support aura powers, which makes them force multipliers (especially when you get multiples of them together).

Why not make a Fortunata?

This one isn't quite so clear cut, mainly because the answer is somewhat counterintuitive.

Let me give you an example from my own direct experience ... my twin Defenders that I'm still (slowly) working on getting up to Level 50 as Praetorians.

• Time Manipulation/Dual Pistols
• Kinetics/Dual Pistols/Psychic Mastery

At first blush ... "just by the numbers" ... it looks like these two builds are basically "mirrors" of each other.

• Both take all 9 primary + all 9 secondary powers.
• Both take all 3 leadership toggles.

That's 9+9+3=21 out of 24 power picks in common between the two builds ... so how different can they be to "finish out" and build?

Turns out they're RADICALLY DIFFERENT.

The first and most obvious difference is that Kinetics is notoriously "anemic" on demand for slots due to a lack of set invention options. By contrast, Time Manipulation is very "hungry" on demand for slots due to a wealth of options for set inventions and thus set bonuses. This then creates a very noticeable ... shift ... in the distribution of slots in the entirety of the build, which then enables Kinetics to play to a very different set of "strengths" than you can with Time Manipulation (due to the enhancement slots budget).

It's something I wouldn't have noticed/found until I tried to interpolate one build into the other and found the dramatic mismatch of opportunity going on in Kinetics vis-a-vis Time Manipulation. This in turn dictates how the "22-24 out of 24 power picks" can wind up being so dramatically different between the two builds.

• Time Manipulation ... the "remaining 3" power picks must all be 0+0+0=0 added slots One Slot Wonders™.
• Kinetics ... the "remaining 3" power picks can have 5+6+0=11 slots added between them, making a Mastery/Patron Pool choice practical and even overall build defining.

So why am I bringing up this (tangential) example in the context of Night Widow vs Fortunata?
Because the same dynamic is at work.

The Night Widow can be done as a "tighter" build plan ... fewer attack powers, means fewer slots needed ... which in turn leaves more margin remaining for greater investment into support powers that are force multipliers. The "center of gravity" in a Widow build can be "shifted" relative to where it "wants to be" in a Fortunata build, yielding a different mix that (can) lean heavier into support powers than you can get away with on a Fortunata. In other words, the Night Widow can be built "more efficiently" in ways that aren't directly obvious if all you're doing is looking at a spreadsheet list (or a Mids' screenshot).

The ... BLEND ... isn't the same.
This gives Night Widows options to do some things that Fortunata builds might struggle to afford, due to the demand on power picks and slots for their "core" set of powers that define how a Fortunata "ought to" be built and played.

Night Widow builds CAN BE done as something of a "less is more" type of exercise, which then enables more variety and versatility in build plans than you might think you can get away with as a Fortunata. How you get there is somewhat counterintuitive, but the real key lies in the number of One Slot Wonder™ powers (such as Vengeance, slotted with the Luck of the Gambler global recharge buff) making it possible to make FULL slot investments into other power picks, while still maintaining a "decent" attack chain rotation potential with minimal downtime.

So the best answer I can give you to the question of "Why not a Fortunata?" is ... because a Fortunata doesn't always have the flexibility to build the way that a Night Widow can. The comparison doesn't always line up 1 to 1 (and if you force it to, then you're kind of "picking a side" from the start).

Good heavens that's one way to go as 'hard mode' as possible on leveling!  I suppose with the anniversary double / triple xp coming up next week, that'd be the best time possible to try this if you really wanted to.

I've decided to go ahead and give this a try.
Already launched my Soldier of Arachnos ... who I intend to raise into a Huntsman (crabbermind) build akin to what I did back on Virtue server (back in the day).

I've never played a Widow before, but I think I'll try the "eat my own dog food" approach of trying out the Dart Widow playstyle I outlined above ... mainly because it's SO DIFFERENT from anything that anyone else has done (or popularized) before. The fact that I'll be playing as a "runaway" from Arachnos in Praetoria (Nova, Imperial, Neutropolis, First Ward, Night Ward) rather than taking the "usual path" in the Rogue Isles (because my game client crashes WAY TOO RELIABLY there, still) will definitely make this something of a Road Less Never Traveled Before, so I'll certainly feel like I'm blazing a trail/pioneering with this pair of characters (even if they wind up doing nothing but street sweeping from 2-19 before getting into First Ward).

Now I just need to come up with a really cool/clever name for a Dart Widow ...

I'd do it myself, but Redside Zones are entirely too "fatal crash to desktop" RELIABLE for me to even entertain the notion right now.

Hmmm ... I wonder ...

I could make a Widow and a Soldier ... and then instead of staying in the Rogue Isles, I could ... at Level 1-2 ... use the TUNNEL Network to "run away from Arachnos" to Praetoria and then street sweep my way to Level 50 without ever returning to the Rogue Isles.

Well, maybe come back to the Rogue Isles JUST ONCE to register a Redside Supergroup @ Level 10 before returning to Praetoria and resume street sweeping in SG Mode: ON so as to be able to build up a Villain Base (for inventory storage and decorative fun times).

Would certainly make for the weirdest possible backstory history for a couple of VEATs ...

Yes, with enough set bonuses and recharge you could make a Dart Widow... and immediately become nonfunctional again any time you get malefactored down too far, lose incarnate, and/or lose set bonuses.

Which then brings up the (obvious) question ... how "low" do you have to go for that condition to be true?

The answer partially depends on your plan for enhancement slotting.

I myself follow an intentional pattern of Levels 22, 27, 31 and "minimum" for enhancement slots.
22 - 3 = Level 19 ... the upper end of a collection of 15-19 flashback arcs
27 - 3 = Level 24 ... the upper end of a collection of 20-24 flashback arcs AND is also above the SO enhancement "break even" point
31 - 3 = Level 28 ... the maximum available for the Moonfire TF and falls within the range of the 25-29 flashback arcs
Procs "don't care" about enhancement levels (except for the purposes of set bonuses) so I just slot set procs at their minimum levels to they're "always working as early as possible" for any global bonuses they might grant.

Levels 19+ and 24+ comprise a supermajority of the content in the game that can be (re)played.
At Levels 18- any IOs you've slotted (aside from purples) will be getting "downgraded" when you exemplar/malefactor anyway, so you're going to FEEL "underpowered" no matter what you do, relative to any sort of Level 50 (incarnate slotted) playing experience.

As for whether or not you can form a "viable" (as opposed to "optimal") attack chain using only ranged and pool attacks at extremely low levels when playing a Widow ...

• Level 1 (Widow Training): Poison Dart
• Level 6 (Widow Training): Dart Burst
• Level 1 (Night Widow Training): Mental Blast
• Level 8 (Night Widow Training): Build Up
• Level 12 (Night Widow Training): Smoke Grenade
• Level 32 (Night Widow Training): Psychic Scream
• Level 4 (Gadgetry): Nano Net
• Level 4 (Gadgetry): Energy Gauntlet
• Level 14 (Gadgetry): Gauntlet Barrage
• Level 20 (Gadgetry): Force Barrier

My point being that you could EASILY dip into the Gadgetry pool as a Dart Widow (not yet a Night Widow) in order to round out a Ranged Only attack chain prior to the Level 24 Respec as a Night Widow ... if you really wanted to. That way, even if you exemplar/malefactor down below Patron Pool Levels, you've still got "most" of your attack chain available to you.

I would also point out that if you decide to take Force Barrier @ Level 20, you would be able to exemplar/malefactor down to Level 15 (Virgil Tarikoss SF, Positron: Rule of Three TF) and still have access to your Force Barrier power for self-protection.



Would your build be "diminished" by going that low when exemplared/malefactored?
Yes.

Would your build be "non-functional" by going that low when exemplared/malefactored?
No.
You'd still be able to attack and defend yourself. You'd still be able to "get around town" ... even if you have to resort to Ninja Run+Sprint to do it. But you'll want to "build carefully" such that you pick your "critical powers" as early as possible so you'll "always have them" when you exemplar/malefactor down to REALLY low levels. Anything you pick during Levels 1-6 will ALWAYS be available to you ... even if you exemplar/malefactor down to Level 1 (because 6-5=1). So whatever your Levels 1+1, 2, 4, 6 power picks are, you'll ALWAYS have those available no matter what. Set bonuses are a different matter (of course), but there are limits on "how low you can go" with the levels on enhancements before compromising your performance at the upper end (Level 50 + Incarnate content, basically).



Remember ... enhancements continue to "work" (in full) until exemplared/malefactored -3 Levels below the Level of the enhancements themselves. Powers continue to be available until exemplared/malefactored -5 Levels below the level at which the power was picked/chosen.

[LINK]

Ah, here's the link to the post I was thinking about (on Homecoming) ... LINK

Night Widow build with 5 Cones (thanks to Leviathan Mastery) ...

• Dart Burst
• Psychic Scream
• School of Sharks
• Bile Spray
• Arctic Breath

If you Frankenslot all of those Cones with 2x Rolling Barrage + 2x HO: Damage/Range + 2x Procs each ... that will yield (+7.5*5)=+37.5% Range global bonus to ALL powers.

• 50 * 1.375 = 68.75ft ... before including Range slotted into 50ft Cone attacks
• 60 * 1.375 = 82.5ft ... before including Range slotted into 60ft Cone attacks
• 80 * 1.375 = 110ft ... before including +Range buffing 80ft Single Target attacks

Throw in an Alpha slot that offers +Range (Cardiac or Intuition) and you'll have some SERIOUS "reach out and touch you" power going on!

Might be worth looking into ...

[LINK]

That is when I discovered that Night Widow kind of... doesn't have a reason to exist.  Everything a Night Widow can do, a Fortunata can do better.

I wouldn't be quite so quick to come to that conclusion.

City of Data v1.0 (internet archived): LINK
City of Data v1.0 Arachnos Widow: LINK

My reason for pulling these links is because they do not include any modifications by Homecoming and represent the legacy/LIVE server (2012) stats for cross comparison review.

Build Up, which is mutually exclusive to the base kit's Follow Up (both are good, this will largely come down to personal preference).

One really major difference here is utility/use cases between these two powers.

Follow Up:

• Range: 7 ft
• Recharge: 12 seconds
• Target: Foe
• +10% ToHit for 10s (after 0.2 second delay)
• +30% Dmg(All Types) for 10s (after 0.2 second delay)

Build Up:

• Range: -
• Recharge: 90 seconds
• Target: Self
• +20% ToHit for 10s
• +80% Dmg(All Types) for 10s

The major MAJOR difference between these two powers is that Follow Up is an attack that requires you to hit something. Follow Up CAN be used for an auto-crit out of Hidden status, but then you aren't getting the +30% bonus damage out of Hide on the auto-crit. Furthermore, to my knowledge, Follow Up is not self-stackable (it overwrites any remaining duration) so it's not like you can have 2x Follow Up buff stacks going on simultaneously (for a +20%/+60% combination). Another factor is that Follow Up is a melee damaging attack, so you really want to be slotting it for melee damage, which makes things like a 6-slot Gaussian's Set impractical in this power.

By contrast, you CAN use Build Up on yourself for all that lovely bonus damage and THEN still auto-crit out of Hidden status if you want to (with the +80% bonus damage applied to the crit). This means that Build Up works "better" as an alpha striker (self) buff that does not require attacking a (melee) $Target, which in turn makes Build Up more suitable as a buff option for a set of attack powers that concerns itself more with range than with melee. A 6-slot Gaussian's set in this power is quite practical (if you have the slots available for it, that is).

In my estimation, Follow Up is "better" (in the sense of having more uptime) if you're playing in melee with more of a Scrapperlock mindset and playstyle. You can keep the damage buff "up" most of the time so long as there are Foes to smack around in melee. By contrast, Build Up is DEFINITELY the way to go for a more "range based" powerset and playstyle, or simply one where you want to be damage buffed for your opening attacks (from Hide for auto-crits or not) and want a more "bursty" type of playstyle rather than a "steady stream" of melee buffing type of play.



So for argument and illustration purposes, let's say that you wanted to create a "Ranged Widow" who eschews the melee fighting style in favor of ranged attacks (much like how the Huntsman eschews Mace/Backpack attacks in favor of using the Arachnos Rifle). What happens?

• Poison Dart (single target): 4s recharge, 80ft range
• Dart Burst (30º cone): 8s recharge, 50ft radius (enhanceable!)
• Mental Blast (single target): 4s recharge, 80ft range
• Smoke Grenade (target AoE): 15s recharge, 110ft range, 35ft radius, 60s perception debuff cancels when damaged
• Psychic Scream (30º cone): 16s recharge, 60ft radius (enhanceable!)

Looking at the Smoke Grenade, I get the feeling that it is SERIOUSLY underestimated, for the reason that you (almost) cite ... it's not build defining. However, for a Ranged Widow it most certainly CAN BE.

Why?
Because it allows you to convert "parallel threats" into sequential ones, where YOU get to choose the order of operations to defeat your opposition. Remember, Foes who cannot perceive you cannot target you ... and thus cannot attack you. This means that you can (effectively) "range debuff" your opponents such that only 1 of them (the one you're damaging) can attack you at a time ... at which point, all you have to do is stay out of melee range and you're already "winning" on the protection front.

The downside to this strategy is that it doesn't work all that well in groups (where AoE is getting thrown around like party favors). As soon as a mob affected by Smoke Grenade gets damaged, the Perception debuff drops, so AoE damage is "not your friend" with respect to deployment of this power. BUT ... it does mean that it becomes possible to pick groups apart with single target attacks after using Smoke Grenade (if you've got the patience and/or cooperation to do so). Perhaps a better way to think of how Smoke Grenade "ought to be used" is more like a (poor man's) AoE Placate that enables a DIVIDE TO CONQUER playstyle ... and if your attacks are biased in favor of range rather than melee, you're maximizing your own advantages in contrast to the disadvantages you're heaping upon your Foes.

With enough global recharge from set bonuses (Hasten, et al.) you can actually have a reasonably decent single target ranged attack chain using JUST Poison Dart and Mental Blast. Look at the Arcanatimes for both powers.

• Poison Dart: 1.716s
• Mental Blast: 1.848s

Both powers have a 4s recharge time. Therefore:

• 4 / 1.716 = 2.3310
• 4 / 1.848 = 2.1645

Which means that with a +133.10% or +116.45% global recharge buff (of which perma-Hasten can be +70% and Mental Training adds another +20%) you can simply alternate these 2 single target attacks indefinitely with no downtime, if you wanted to.

With "a lot of global recharge" you can start throwing around Smoke Grenades REPEATABLY in combat ... which means that even if there's lots of AoE damage getting thrown around (liberally), Foes will still (momentarily) lose Perception of their $Target(s) and thus will need to "reacquire" targeting on You (and your Allies) after they get damaged again. The phrase "wash, rinse, repeat" comes to mind with what you can do with LOTS of global recharge combined with Smoke Grenade, because you can just keep throwing the debuff at them "fast enough" to be noticeable in sustained combat. So it would behave more like a "soft mez" (kind of like a knockdown or a sleep) rather than a "hard mez" (like a hold), but it could have some pretty seriously disruptive implications, both in solo and group play, once you learn the dynamics of how Smoke Grenade ACTUALLY works (and how to take maximum advantage!).

Furthermore, you can Frankenslot the Poison Dart and Psychic Scream cone attack powers with 2-slot Rolling Barrage (+7.5% Range to all powers set bonus) and 2x HO: Damage/Range enhancements (to maximize the cone radius!) leaving 2 slots for procs (-Resistance debuffing always being a good choice!).

Throw either Hover/Fly or Mystic Flight into the mix for "3D keep away" opportunism and you can really stack the deck in your favor, relative to playing a Melee Widow.

You then have a 2x single + 2x cone set of attacks, which then radically prunes down the number of attack powers that you need to find slots for ... which then means you can redistribute a LOT of slots to other aspects of your build plan, severely advantaging your play in other ways relative to your peers.



My point being, there is plenty of unrealized potential in the Night Dart Widow ... just like playing a Huntsman (whether HuntsBane or HuntsCrabbermind) is a different way to play a Soldier of Arachnos. The playstyle may be similar, but there are important differences that yield extremely noticeable changes in HOW YOU PLAY the character.

Mind Link (see Fortunata)

You know what I noticed about the differences between Night Widow and Fortunata with respect to Mind Link?
The recharge time(s) ...

• Mind Link (Night Widow): 240s recharge, +5% ToHit for 90s, +30% Res(Psionic) for 90s, +10% All Defense Types, All Defense Positions for 90s
• Mind Link (Fortunata): 300s, +5% ToHit for 90s, +30% Res(Psionic) for 90s, +10% All Defense Types, All Defense Positions for 90s

That makes a difference in how "perma-able" the two branches are, with respect to this power.

• 240 / 90 = 2.6667
• 300 / 90 = 3.3333

Therefore, a Night Widow needs +166.67% global recharge buffing to make this power perma-able, and of that amount, +70% can come from Hasten and +20% can come from Mental Training ... leaving a +76.67% global recharge "demand" from set bonuses in order to make this Mind Link perma (for self and others).

A Fortunata needs 233.33% global recharge buffing to make this power perma-able, and of that amount, +70% can come from Hasten ... leaving a 163.33% global recharge "demand" from set bonuses in order to make this Mind Link perma (for self and others) ... GOOD LUCK with that. Incidentally, I'm thinking that the fact that the amount of global recharge needed being 2.13x as much for a Fortunata as a Night Widow is not an accident, nor a coincidence. Basically, Night Widows are "better" at Mind Linking (for coordinated defense) than their Fortunata counterparts.

Just because the powers LOOK the same, doesn't mean that they integrate or "build" the same @ Level 50 in a completed build. There are important implications in those differences, especially since Mind Link doesn't accept Recharge enhancements (so you have to use global recharge factors in order to reach perma-able status).

I've seen more Regeneration characters than I have Night Widows

I know that the Dart Widow build has been tried before (remarkably successfully!) (albeit, not by me, I've never played one) and thoroughly enjoyed, but is almost unheard of in the wider community. If you're wondering how a Night Widow "might be better/more fun to play" than a Fortunata, you might want to give the really oddball build of the Dart Widow a try and see what you come up with. I'm thinking that Mystic Flight (enabling access to Spirit Ward, Enflame and Rune of Protection) combined with Smoke Grenade could enable some particularly tricky 3D maneuvering/positioning potential that would be extremely unfair to Foes. Also, DEFINITELY go for Combat Training (all) + Tactical Training (all) + Leadership (all toggles+vengeance!) and you'll be a force to be reckoned with on the battlefield ... because EVERYONE AROUND YOU gets BETTER at what they do in your presence, just by the fact of you Being There™!

At the very least, it would be something WELL OFF the well worn and trodden down path of the Blaster/Offender/Corruptor/Soldier route and would be something remarkably unique for you to play. 

I'd do it myself, but Redside Zones are entirely too "fatal crash to desktop" RELIABLE for me to even entertain the notion right now.

You will genuinely have better DPA dropping the mace and using the rifle, except at that point you're not really a Bane Spider, are you?  Bah.

At that point you're a Huntsman (rifle only attacks).

As a (former) Arachnos Soldier on previous servers (crashes to desktop on redside are just WAY TOO RELIABLE for me on Rebirth), playing a HuntsBane is actually a remarkably poor symmetry as a build. The underlying strengths of the Bane are basically "to be a Stalker with better group buffs" ... which means Stealth/Hide/Placate and bonus damage when making melee attacks with your Mace. This is where the Bane plays catch up on DPA, through damage buffing on attacks from Hidden (just like a Stalker) ... and just like with Stalkers, it isn't enough when fighting in sustained combat, but works just fine in "bursty" quick combat. But none of those damage bonuses for being Hidden accrue to attacks made using the Arachnos Rifle. So a HuntsBane is this sort of weird hybrid of a blaster/defender who can stealth (which suppresses in combat).

To my mind, the primary and overriding reason to choose Bane is because you don't want to wear a Crab Backpack for the rest of your life. Bane gets a few options to augment the playstyle, but they're mostly oriented around melee combat (ala Stalker) using the Mace while being a better team buffbot.

Conversely, a HuntsCrab gets Pets to herd and a Dull Pain equivalent power for increased survivability, rather than angling for sneaky/stealthy/assassin-y type powers and playstyle like the Bane does.

so yeah lv28

Then that is an end user scenario that I was not previously aware of.
Good to know that there's always "more to learn" in this game! 

[I need them all at Lvl 28]

the catch: I need them all at Lvl 28

Why would you want them @ Level 28 ... instead of Level 27?

At Level 28, the set bonuses are "operative" down to Level 25 (-3 below the enhancement level) ... but in terms of flashback story arc content, the brackets are:

• 1-15
• 16-19
• 20-24
• 25-29
• 30-34
• 35-39
• 40-45
• 46-50

I suppose that if your only concern is about TF/SF exemplar limits, those tend to be "multiples of 5" Levels (15, 20, 25, 30, etc.), at which point Level 28 for enhancements to slot makes some sense ... but personally I would prefer (and use) Level 27 for enhancements (whenever practical) rather than Level 28. Being able to do flashback content and retain set bonuses @ Exemplar Level 24 tends to be beneficial in the long run (I'm thinking).

There are some sets I try to obtain as Level 22 (so the set bonus is "operative" in the Exemplar Level 16-19 flashback bracket), while others I try to obtain as Level 31 (so the set bonus is "operative" in the Moonfire Task Force at Exemplar Level 28).